first gen crash safety help please

You will never see FC configurations revived in any modern passenger vehicle design. I was very surprised to see the FC Toyota mini-van appear on the market back in the late 80's.

Dodge A100s offered V8s from when they were introduced in '64. The engine is actually behind the front axle.

I have had my A100 over 70 mph. It likes 63 mph better.

FWIW - I would never ride on a motorcycle, but I will take my chances with an Early.

Does it help distribute the weight better when they move the V8's back into the bed of the pickups a bit?

NoBiggie wrote:Does it help distribute the weight better when they move the V8's back into the bed of the pickups a bit?

Those bad boys usually have a sub-frame with the engine/trans/rear-end tied together without a drive shaft.
The front ends on those have been known to jump up from time to time.

True enough. Thats why the Dodge A100 was a little bit better designed and beefier than the Econolines. Engine set back about 8" more than the Econoline balanced the weight across the entire frame. Heavier frame allowed for same or more payload without the tipping forward issue when empty.

I'm a loyal Dodge guy, but they had a rear weight on the PUs too.
To the OP, these vans were designed before the initial safety push in the mid-60s. For you to retrofit safety into the design, you will have to incorporate a lot of changes that will by necessity change the character of them and as noted, make changes to the overall design to bring back some semblance of road manners.
I can suggest the following not as something I have done, but as levels that would seem to make sense.

Better braking and handling. These have been done and will make it more modern and increase your ability to avoid collisions.

Incorporate stronger seat mounts and 3 point belts. This is the first step in keeping you in place.

Add structure to the nose, tied into the hinge area and add door beams, to pass energy around you to the body.

Move the driving position back some. This would require moving the seat back, tilting the steering column back and moving the pedals back. Side vision will be affected. Dodge did this in the 94-up B vans compared to earlier B vans.

Install a roll cage.

Move the engine/trans back and use an IRS so the driveshaft can be eliminated. This will allow the doghouse to move back and allow you to move the seating and controls back also.

Install active belts and air bags.


Most of this is going to be expensive and require a lot of thought, engineering and time.
It would be easier to move to a different vehicle than to really make one of these 'safe'.
You could go to a later American van for a slight increase, a later japanese van, or a japanese van with a conversion if you must have the look (sorta).

I understand the OP's intent with the message. I never thought about the front end lack of safety when I was younger, but I do more now that I am a bit older. Regardless, I still joke about the potential of being "the first one on the accident scene" because I drive an FC van.

I try to comfort myself by the fact that my van is made of METAL. I feel safer in a METAL vehicle than a modern one made of fiberglass and plastic with styrofoam bumpers. I feel I might just "win" in a crash if I were ever in one if the other driver was in a modern car made of proverbial saran wrap. There is just more structure to a vintage vehicle period.

Anyway- that is just my take. I drive cautiously, but there is nothing else I feel I need to do to make my trucks safer for a front end collision.

don't forget about the stock steering wheel shaft being a solid shaft with no rag joints. it doesn't colaspe in a colision, it impales!
wildbillinva

Crash Safety? Steering shaft Impailment?? Isnt that why when we get older - we wear =DEPENDS?????

Still Driving the early vans=Happy Vannin

Kinda like when i was teaching Flying Airplanes?? In case of a crash landing at night - turn on the landing lighte & if you dont like what you see?? Turn them off!!

Yea that steering column is one thing I would like to change out for a tilt....But finding something to fit the steering box, I think is almost impossable. Finding the proper size column with a steering box attached Would be a lot of modifying underneath. Then there's the shifter linkage...yea way to much work. But I don't want to change it for safety reasons, I just want a tilt column for ease of drivability. Welding on a column is not allowed up here in Saskatchewan...no insurence if found in an accident. But maybe there is something in the after market world that just bolts in...Now that we can do up here. Now There's a thought...Check with your local insurance company and see what changes you are allowed to make. Your modifications may void your insurance if they are not approved by them. I no up here I was given a book on the "do and Don't" of modifying a vehicle by our gov't insurance company. I was surprised to find out what was not allowed. I'm running out of pennies...but there's another 2 cents.

sorry to hear that news big w what a pita! for others i would think you could adapt the original coloumn for a colapsable one and just attach it at the base by cutting and fitting a rag joint?
i wanted a second gen van but for my purpous at the time it was just too wide and awkward for parts. the only issue i have with the 1st gen is its forward control position.

theres loads of different old and new forward control vehicles its not just a 60s thing i just dont trust any of them much

Dodge waited and watched what Ford did with the Econoline. The A100 was a heavier, beefier vehicle with greater payload. It was also a bit wider. I've owned both and while I like the look of the Econoline better, the greater shoulder room of the A100 was nice.

Hey Rod, where did you get the picture of the van that looks like a retro A100? Pretty neat!

It's a kit in Japan to convert a modern Kei van.

A brief history of them
http://mjs.home.xs4all.nl/cabover.html

If you're worried about modifying the steering column, what about replacing wit with a "Steer Clear" unit. I've seen this used in an Econo before (maybe Van Go).

http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Steer-Clear-Steering-Box-Drop-Polished-Finish,37605.html

Seems a lot has been rehashed over and over again since Page 1, I have 2, drive them and have fun be happy. or get something new.

Thirty years ago, my Œ65 hit the side of a four-door sedan going about 30 MPH. The sedan stopped at a stop sign, but pulled out in front of me anyway.

The front end was smashed up. Lost a lot of Bondo! The driver door was stuck shut. The floor around the pedals was bent a little. I drove it that way for a few months until I could fix up another E-van.

Thankfully, I was wearing a lapbelt.

Disc brakes would have helped me stop faster. I like the idea of beefing up the front bumper with a steel angle. I might look at moving the front bumper out front a few more inches.

My 64 Econo came with the 7" peanut rear that screamed bloody murder at 55mph (now swapped for a 3.50 9" - MUCH better). My point is that Ford never intended these things for interstate cruising, other than incidental. It was a delivery/service truck, period.

35 years ago I drove my '66 A100 coast to coast and back. I used to think I would simply pick my feet up if I was ever in a front end crash, although realistically I doubt I would have had the presence of mind to do so. My current Econo has good radial tires, dual master cylinder, front disc brakes, seat belts and good mirrors (I have NO windows). I drive cautiously and leave lots of room around me, staying out of really busy traffic as best as I can. I don't worry too much - I'm just really careful. And as others have noted, I'll bet our odds of survival are way better than on a motorcycle.

Im just Like scarlin- Just drive it ! If worrys get to you about "What Might Happen??" sell it! get a Tank or become an Engineer on a Train? These earlys-vans or otherwise cars =were never built for crash Safety! Happy Vannin!!=

I'm late to this but i'll share my thought

This was a fast street car that i built years ago. I drove this car everywhere, i felt very safe in it. The car was loud, the color was loud and it just felt safe.



Making a car ridged isn't always good. We lost a local racer to a minor fender bender because of the cage. He was wearing his seat belt but he still moved enough to hit the bar above his head.

I've got two small kids and they both ask every time we go somewhere if one can sit up front in my A. My answer will never change.... NO!!!!!

I got hit by a drunk one night a long time ago. I didn't get a scratch, but the guy that hit me stuck his face through his windshield, he was driving a delta 88. I was driving one of my vans a 66. I cut it up shortly after.

the hubcap stayed on, but the door didn't.
No seatbelts, my girlfriend was riding on the doghouse, she conked her head on the metal above the windshield. We got married a few months later.

Rod & Gotavan= my winners here-I like the ladys front end protection!!

ROD ALL I CAN SAY IS O MY GOD !!

with todays tech. what happened to the smart car, what is safe about that.

A while back I took a length of channel 5x2x3/8 (ota) and cut, bent and welded it to fit behind the angles and contours of my A120's bumper, where it sits out of sight. Though much stronger than just the bumper, I've always known it to be merely a deterrent. But now after seeing Dan's bumper I think I'll throw some webbing into the channel to add a little more beef.