first gen crash safety help please

thanks for the more usefull replies!

but maybe il re phrase my question?

has anybody here found a way to make one of these vans SAFER and protect yourself BETTER in a front end CRASH? without ruining its exterior looks too much?

Better seat (with a head rest), 3 point seat belts, reinforced bumper. It's all been done, and that's probably the extent of it without changing the look and feel. or....turn it around...

http://inlinethumb40.webshots.com/45607/2704979710078212222S600x600Q85.jpg

thats it!! do a backup-pickup or van -Talk about front end safetyy!! Yea Baby!!

My thought is to keep a gasser stance and just go Over whats in front of you. My other suggestion: Be the first to try and make it better/safer! All the common things have been done, add to the list.

Digz wrote:My thought is to keep a gasser stance and just go Over whats in front of you. My other suggestion: Be the first to try and make it better/safer! All the common things have been done, add to the list.

well i dont really know what the common things are. sure i have ideas but thats why im asking here as it must have come up before?
so what is this list?

Actually, I have seen a B van with a nice partial cage.
It could be adapted to an A, but the big thing is to move back and add some crush zone, along with added structure to the front and sides. Hard to do in a panel, but you could do it with a window van.

First of all, you have to understand what the vans and pickups were originally designed for. They were NOT designed for interstate speeds or driving. When these cab forward vans and pickups were designed there were no interstates. Designing began back in 1957. These were originally intended for urban utility work. Delivery vans for light loads such as clothes cleaner, TV repair, electrical & plumbing contractors. The buses were designed for the roads of the day, not interstates. Speeds were less and traffic was less.

So, as far as safety goes, if you take one of these vans or trucks outside their safety design zone, you could get hurt. Speeds over 60 miles an hour and heavy traffic is not what they were designed for. That is what Ford designed the second generation and third generation vans for. Like any tool, you can't use it outside of its design specifications and expect it and be safe.

Here you go!

Rod, when the Zombies attack, I want this bad lookin Dodge to cruiz in!

i'll ride shotgun !!

twday wrote:First of all, you have to understand what the vans and pickups were originally designed for. They were NOT designed for interstate speeds or driving. When these cab forward vans and pickups were designed there were no interstates. Designing began back in 1957.

Yes and no. The interstate system began construction in 1956, but teh plans had been in the works for decades. Ford certainly knew about this and planned for it for vehicles being released in the 1960s. However, I'm sure you're right that these vans were designed for lower, local speeds for use as delivery trucks... except for the windowed passenger vans. Either way, I'm sure both types of vans/trucks saw plenty of highway speeds, interstate or not. Paved highways with higher speed limits had been around long before construction began on the interstate system

come on any of these vans are capable of 60+ mph! besides a 40 mph crash will have the front wrapped around your feet! plus whats to stop the other guy doing 60 mph into u? and theres plenty of people who have made there vans capable of much more speed v8s cammed motors etc etc etc wich must be well outside its ,,safety zone,, we cant go back in time to quieter roads and we cant choose if and when we are going to get in a shunt people still crashed in the 60s!

so all i am trying to do is find the best way to make it safer in a front end.
collision.

better brakes tires driving habits area of the country have nothing to do with it when the $hit hits the fan (wich is about where your knees are)

on a side note actually i just remmebered i had a crash in a 70s van at about 35 mph t boned a guy coming out a junction on a rural road it wrapped the radiator around the motor and the doors wouldn open i hit my knees on the dash had it been a first gen god knows what it would have been like

modified, there is no silver bullet. it’s a calculated risk you take or not. the future is unwritten. I think we know there is no answer that is going to satisfy you. I was in all sorts of accidents when I was younger (flipped over/t-boned/rear ended/in the ditch and through a brick wall) and had no concept of trying to keep on living. just dumb luck I survived. if you get a vehicle from 1967 and it’s in decent condition, then you have a survivor. of course that’s no guarantee you won’t die in it tomorrow.

pick your safety level. we can’t talk you into it. I see people do far dumber stuff (than drive a vintage van) every day.

modified wrote:come on any of these vans are capable of 60+ mph! besides a 40 mph crash will have the front wrapped around your feet! plus whats to stop the other guy doing 60 mph into u? and theres plenty of people who have made there vans capable of much more speed v8s cammed motors etc etc etc wich must be well outside its ,,safety zone,, we cant go back in time to quieter roads and we cant choose if and when we are going to get in a shunt people still crashed in the 60s!

so all i am trying to do is find the best way to make it safer in a front end.
collision.

better brakes tires driving habits area of the country have nothing to do with it when the $hit hits the fan (wich is about where your knees are)

on a side note actually i just remmebered i had a crash in a 70s van at about 35 mph t boned a guy coming out a junction on a rural road it wrapped the radiator around the motor and the doors wouldn open i hit my knees on the dash had it been a first gen god knows what it would have been like

They are what they are, seems maybe a early van just isnt for you.

Boils down to driving habits, speeds,attention span , cell phone & text usage, distractions, Hot coffee on the crotch,& many things-for me -I never had any problems or wrecks =EVER!! I just dont actually worry about it!! Reminds me about how some people worry about getting out of bed in the morning??

I must add also- as far as frontal safety goes-I always did like a lady with really Big Boobs!!

i cant seem to get this across.
all i am trying to do is find a way to help make it safer in the front
if i were asking about how to upgrade the brakes i would get a better responce

its simple we upgrade our brakes we put cages and harnesses in race cars so what can i do to strengthen the front?

some good suggestions have been made and im gratefull for to those posters
but it also sounds like theres this ,,list,, of things that are commonly done im sure theres somebody out there that has done something? and i absolutley agree theres a van 1965 never been in a wreck it doesnt meen jack i could wreck it within a mile of ownership

i have ideas but im here to learn from those that have allready done it

Maybe not many here have done what you are asking, be an innovator, design and build it and post for others to see.

kgdb wrote:

modified wrote:come on any of these vans are capable of 60+ mph! besides a 40 mph crash will have the front wrapped around your feet! plus whats to stop the other guy doing 60 mph into u? and theres plenty of people who have made there vans capable of much more speed v8s cammed motors etc etc etc wich must be well outside its ,,safety zone,, we cant go back in time to quieter roads and we cant choose if and when we are going to get in a shunt people still crashed in the 60s!

so all i am trying to do is find the best way to make it safer in a front end.
collision.

better brakes tires driving habits area of the country have nothing to do with it when the $hit hits the fan (wich is about where your knees are)

on a side note actually i just remmebered i had a crash in a 70s van at about 35 mph t boned a guy coming out a junction on a rural road it wrapped the radiator around the motor and the doors wouldn open i hit my knees on the dash had it been a first gen god knows what it would have been like

They are what they are, seems maybe a early van just isnt for you.

I would have to agree, if you are so concerned maybe 1st/ 2nd gen vans are not for you.imho

RodStRace wrote:Here you go!

ROTFLMAO

The windowed passenger vans were no more stable at high speeds than the panel vans or pickups. There true designed purpose was urban use not interstate use. Read Ford's history of their van design. That is why they made such a drastic change in design between the 1st gen vans and the 2nd generation vans. More vehicles were using interstates and that's also why V-8's were finally offered in Ford vans from the factory.

Modified...I no what your trying to ask.... And what your looking for May not have been done in one of these types of vehicles other then 1/4 mile drag trucks and so on(roll cage). If I could offer a suggestion. Take some pics of these vans, mainly the nose section to an engineer or body shop that specializes in modifying vehicles(4x4 or custome truck place) and see what they suggest. Again I thought of putting a custom bent piece of 1/2 inch x 3 inch flat inside the nose just above the gas peddle that would hook up to the door posts. Then supports down through the floor to the frame. A lot of work and could end up causing more damage if I did get hit on the nose. The energy created in an accident could get transferd to the other side causing even more front end damage, and more work to fix it later. It could be the one time it saves my legs???? Also something to consider is the more waite you put on the nose the higher the ass end will go up in the air causing your now beefed up front end to go down. But check around with some pro shops and see what they would recomend. Anything is possible if you have enough money and time. I hope I'm helping and not causing you more stress...lol.

Adding ANY weight to the front end of a 1st generation Econoline, especially the pickup is a recipe for disaster. The design dynamics already favor a forward weight distribution that is untenable. That is why a 165 lb. counterweight is located over the fuel tank. For every pound of weight added to the front, 1.5 ibs. must be added to the rear. The reason for this is that Ford designed the Econolines with the payload as part of the balancing weight. It is a utility vehicle and was designed as such. The payload IS the offsetting balance to the pre-loaded front end when these vehicles are empty. These trucks and vans were NOT designed to have V-8 motors because of the balance between the pre-loaded front end weight and the anticipated payload weight. So from an engineers standpoint, modifying any aspect of an Econoline is not a good idea as it was designed as a specific purpose vehicle with no room for weight balance modifications.

Now, understanding that, any modification to reinforce one area will tend to weaken another area, whether in a head on crash or otherwise. So, the best way to enjoy these pickups and vans is to keep them in the configuration they were designed in and make sure they are mechanically sound, especially the brakes. Don't follow close and drive defensively and you can enjoy these fun vehicles with little or no concern for tragedy.

big w some good points there and kind of what i had in mind. for my own van i would prob have a 4 cyl motor wich should be lighter plus put batteries fuel tank etc at the rear the suspesnion would be a little lowered all round but level and disc brakes on all 4 wheels good seats moved back and belts infact taking this to another level i know somebody will make a huge fuss about this but its no big deal to have working airbags! beef up the bumpers and move them out a little naybe even have a double bumper a bit like a model a but use 2 econoline or 2 55 f100 type.

as for extra weight i dont think the reiforcement would be anywhere near as much as 2 overweight passengers up front!

Seems like you could just have a really awesome 2nd gen van that would satisfy many of your concerns without the huge expense and mods on the 1st gen?