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BRINGING IT ALL TOGETHER.... A's, G's & E's


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    Alternator WOES please help!

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    Post by Guest Fri Dec 07, 2012 2:44 pm

    Man am I glad I found this forum. I have been looking for a while for a forum that can help and this looks like the one to do it.

    OK so I bought a 1963 Econoline for work. This is exactly what I was looking for. The guy I bought it from said the charging light was on and stayed on and he wasnt sure why but that it needed to be addressed.

    Well I tapped on the regulator and the light went out, but when I parked it and took out the key the light went on and stayed on. I bought a new regulator but the light stayed on when I started the van. I looked around and it appears I have an alternator (I should have looked first but I got the regualtor on the way home with it).

    Can some one help me out. The alternator should have a regualtor built in?? Am I right? Also if that is the case there is no need for the stock regulator any more right? How do I wire this so I can still use the dummy light. I have included pics and would really like to fix this so I could start using this for work. Thanks in advance!!

    Alternator WOES please help! DSCF0030
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    Alternator WOES please help! DSCF0027
    Alternator WOES please help! DSCF0026
    scarlin
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    Post by scarlin Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:38 pm

    Hans, You have a 50 year old vehicle that may have come with a generator. Voltage regulators are different for generators and alternators.
    I see you have a ford alt, they have no one wire alts. you really need a wire diagram. One picture looks like a loose ground wire.
    Good luck.
    donivan65
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    Post by donivan65 Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:41 pm

    The alternator needs a regulator to work,,,,,,The regulator should have 4 wires on it,,,,I,,,A+, S and F,,,,,,and the Alternator needs 3 wires going to it,,,,a big output wire, and a wire from the S (white) and F (white/black stripe)terminals from the regulator,,,,,looks like you are missing 1 wire on that alternator,,,,,could be the stator wire,,,,,
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    Post by donivan65 Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:44 pm

    Alternator WOES please help! Ford_c15
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    Post by Guest Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:13 pm

    OK there is a sta on the alternator so then that is the missing wire? What regulator do I get? I have an autozone not too far that I can get one from but not sure what to ask for. Thanks so much guys I really appreciate this!!
    Murdock
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    Post by Murdock Fri Dec 07, 2012 5:33 pm

    donivan65
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    Post by donivan65 Fri Dec 07, 2012 7:43 pm

    They all use the Motorcraft 4 terminal regulator,,,,,HOWEVER,,,,,,the wiring is different depending on if you have an idiot light or an ammeter,,,,,,and basically it is how that S terminal on the regulator gets its power,,,,,for an idiot light,,,,the S terminal on the alternator turns on the regulator which turns on the alternator,,,,on an Ammeter system,,,,,the ignition switch turns on the S terminal on the regulator which turns on the alternator,,,,,and in that case the S terminal on the alternator and the I terminal on the regulator are not used,,,,so see what you got,,,,the things you are looking for are is there an ammeter in the system,,,,is there an idiot light,,,,is the regulator missing one of the 4 wires ,,,,,,you could be stuck 1/2 way between the 2 systems,,,,but we can fix this once you find out what you got,,,,and it may not be right,,,,so tell us more
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    Post by Guest Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:05 pm

    It does have the idiot light. There are 2 wires on the ARM--1 wire on the FLD--and 2 wires on the BAT terminal of the regulator I have now.

    Thanks for taking the time to help me on this!!!

    Alternator WOES please help! DSCF0032
    Alternator WOES please help! DSCF0031
    donivan65
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    Post by donivan65 Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:27 pm

    If the regulator says Arm on it,,,,,that is Armature,,,for a generator,,,,not an alternator,,,,,I don't know that it would supply enough Field current to run an alternator,,,anyways,,,you should make it right,,,,get the regulator that matches the alternator,,,,look at the top picture,,,,you need to hook up 4 wires to the correct regulator,,,,I comes from the idiot light,,,,A+ goes to battery,,,,S and F go to the terminals marked S and F on the alternator,,,,its not hard if you take your time and look at how the circuits and their wires go,,,,,,go get one of those regulators for a Motorcraft alternator,,,,but 1st look around for a new regulator,,,,he may of left that old one hanging there and mounted a new one some place else,,,,lots of stuff can be messed with over 50 years,,,,,you always need to find out what you got,,,,,
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    Post by Guest Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:57 pm

    I looked around for another regulator but that is the only one i see.

    So then will the Duralast VR730 from Autozone work? I will pick this up tomorrow if it does.

    How do I know which wire is the idiot light? Also since A+ is battery on the new regultor what do I do with the small wire that is also hooked up to BAT on the old regulator? What do I do with the 2 wires that are going to the ARM slot of the old regulator?
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    Post by donivan65 Fri Dec 07, 2012 11:52 pm

    Basically you need to add a new S wire from the alternator to the new regulator,,,,I would add new wires and keep the same idiot light wire,,,,you are looking for a 1966 or 67 Ford regulator,,,that 730 will do,,,might be a better price elsewhere,,,,,check these pictures,,,you will get the idea of what to do,,,,and use female spade terminals to connect the wires to the new regulator,,,they probably make an official connector,,,,,


    Alternator WOES please help! Gen_al10
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    Post by Guest Sat Dec 08, 2012 9:04 am

    OK so if I understand I just put all the wires that were with the ARM and BAT on the old regulator with the A+ on the new regulator and then just have new wires for STA and FLD from alternator to the new regulator. Then just make sure my the idiot light is to I. In the diagram the ground wire is coming straight from the altrnator should I do the same thig or use the one that is already there in the harness??
    donivan65
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    Post by donivan65 Sat Dec 08, 2012 9:43 am

    You already got a field wire,,,,cut the small idiot light wire away from the A terminal,,,it goes to the I,,,,,make sure the new regulator is grounded,,,,a wire from its base to the alternator is a good idea,,,,,,get some battery power to that A+ terminal,,,,,you can get it from the starter relay where the positive battery cable hooks to it.......also the big output wire on the alternator hooks up there,,,,,because right now the output is going to the A terminal on your old regulator,,,,it needs to go to the battery instead.....
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    Post by Guest Sat Dec 08, 2012 11:48 am

    OK I think I got it! I will let you know the outcome later when all is done. Sounds easy enough, but never doing it before can be confusing. Thanks again for all the help!!
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    Post by dix Sat Dec 08, 2012 11:55 am

    hansolo welcome to vintage vans. donnivan and the ford gang will get you straighten out...


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    donivan65
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    Post by donivan65 Sat Dec 08, 2012 12:45 pm

    I don't like those generators and alternators with the external regulators,,,,,and all that wiring,,,,If I had a Ford, I would slap one of these 63 amp, lifetime guarantee 2 wire, 3rd Generation Chevy alternators on it,,,,I have been talking about it for years and there are probably a couple of Ford guys that actually listened to me,,,,,you hook the idiot light wire to it and a wire to the battery and you are basically done,,,,it has the regulator built into it,,,,,and 63 amps,,,,,what is that Autolite Alternator put out,,,,35 amps?,,,,,,it's just another choice you have to have a better charging system.......


    Alternator WOES please help! 29_dol16
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    Post by Big W Sat Dec 08, 2012 12:49 pm

    Welcome to VV Hans...You have definatley come to the right place. The Force is strong in here! cheers lol! afro
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    Post by Guest Sat Dec 08, 2012 8:44 pm

    Thank you guys for all the welcomes! It is great to find a forum with this much knowledge and help!!

    So I said I would report back!! Here it goes:

    I bought the regulator and hooked it up exactly as I was told. I put the key in turned it and the idiot light came on, then I cranked it---------The light went out and it works perfect from what I can tell.

    The lights are brighter then they were, it cranks faster then it did and it just sounds better! I cant thank you guys enough!! There is a little more wiring then I like and if I knew about the 1 wire mentioned above I may have went that way, but I worked with what I had and I am happy!!

    I do have more things to work on like how to remove the horn button, how do I test to see if my fuel gauge is bad etc etc, but for now I can use this for work without wondering if I will be stranded somewhere!!

    Many thanks!!
    Murdock
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    Post by Murdock Sun Dec 09, 2012 1:40 pm

    Donivan is right about the alternator. I switched to a one wire Ford style 100A from summit but I have the shunt ammeter, not the idiot light. One less point of failure and cleans up your wiring.

    Horn Button is easy but be sure you pull the ground on your battery first. Just push down and turn it like a pickle jar but don't lose the spring. As far as the fuel gauge the most common issue is a bad ground to the fuel tank, check that first. A 10 ohm resistor in place of your sending unit should make it read full. More info here:

    Gas Gauge Confusion??
    donivan65
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    Post by donivan65 Sun Dec 09, 2012 7:26 pm

    ,,,,,and I got nothing good to say about the weird way Ford gauges work,,,,,check out my picture,,,,I would say, unplug the wire off the gas tank, take a 12 volt test light, hook it to ground,,,test the wire,,,turn the key on and see if the test light blinks,,,,(on all the time or not on is a problem) see what you get then we know what is the next test,,,,,,


    Alternator WOES please help! Gas_ga10

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