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BRINGING IT ALL TOGETHER.... A's, G's & E's


4 posters

    Replacing funky wiring

    arracado
    arracado


    Number of posts : 47
    Location : Medford, OR
    Age : 49
    Registration date : 2018-08-14

    Replacing funky wiring Empty Replacing funky wiring

    Post by arracado Thu Aug 16, 2018 7:27 pm

    So my '64 A100 van has a '93 318 LA motor in it. The previous owner had two positive and two negative cables running from each battery terminal...one set went to either side of the alternator and the other to the regulator/starter and block. Seems redundant to me, but not sure what sort of regulator I should be looking for to get this thing hooked up correctly?
    Dan Scully
    Dan Scully


    Number of posts : 254
    Location : Apple Valley Ca
    Age : 67
    Registration date : 2016-07-30

    Replacing funky wiring Empty Replacing funky wiring

    Post by Dan Scully Thu Aug 16, 2018 8:51 pm

    Depends if they kept the old alternator or have the newer style on the later engine. Can you get a pic of the back of the alternator? Is the distributor still points or electronic?
    arracado
    arracado


    Number of posts : 47
    Location : Medford, OR
    Age : 49
    Registration date : 2018-08-14

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    Post by arracado Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:43 pm

    Thanks for the assist Dan. Pics attached. Still points.Replacing funky wiring 3e2c8a10
    Replacing funky wiring Ee5d8a10
    Replacing funky wiring B627fd10
    Dan Scully
    Dan Scully


    Number of posts : 254
    Location : Apple Valley Ca
    Age : 67
    Registration date : 2016-07-30

    Replacing funky wiring Empty Replacing funky wiring

    Post by Dan Scully Thu Aug 16, 2018 10:05 pm

    That makes things even more different, that is a GM alternator. It will work but need a pic of the alternator where the regulator wiring plugs in on the alternator ,  it can be a external regulator,  internal or a one wire self energizing one.
    donivan65
    donivan65
    Governor
    Governor


    Number of posts : 12218
    Location : San Diego, California
    Registration date : 2008-05-12

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    Post by donivan65 Thu Aug 16, 2018 11:09 pm

    This is what people would use to get rid of the old low output alternator with an external voltage regulator,,,,the regulator is inside it,,,,


    Replacing funky wiring 1b_in_10
    arracado
    arracado


    Number of posts : 47
    Location : Medford, OR
    Age : 49
    Registration date : 2018-08-14

    Replacing funky wiring Empty Re: Replacing funky wiring

    Post by arracado Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:46 am

    Thanks guys. I’ll get under there today and snap a few more pics. In a nutshell the internal wiring for the lights, signals, etc. all seems fine, but I want to rerun everything from the battery to the fuse block (replacing that too).
    arracado
    arracado


    Number of posts : 47
    Location : Medford, OR
    Age : 49
    Registration date : 2018-08-14

    Replacing funky wiring Empty Re: Replacing funky wiring

    Post by arracado Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:18 am

    OK so it looks like the only two wires connected to the alternator go directly to the battery.Replacing funky wiring 0dacc810
    donivan65
    donivan65
    Governor
    Governor


    Number of posts : 12218
    Location : San Diego, California
    Registration date : 2008-05-12

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    Post by donivan65 Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:40 am

    That red output terminal should get to the positive battery cable ,,,,,,,and possibly stopping off 1st at the ammeter and starter,,,,so there is no wires on terminals 1 and 2?,,,,,,,is the battery getting charged,,,,,,are you running 2 batteries?
    arracado
    arracado


    Number of posts : 47
    Location : Medford, OR
    Age : 49
    Registration date : 2018-08-14

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    Post by arracado Fri Aug 17, 2018 12:28 pm

    One battery. I don't know man, this dude had things hooked up kinda funky, so it's possible the battery wasn't getting charged, but I haven't really been able to drive it much and it hasn't been driven much in general for a while. So not really sure. I think I'm just gonna start from scratch, put in a junction box and new regulator and get rid of this duplicate wiring. Plus it all looks like stereo amplifier cable and all of the cables are red! Grrrrrr!!

    donivan65
    donivan65
    Governor
    Governor


    Number of posts : 12218
    Location : San Diego, California
    Registration date : 2008-05-12

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    Post by donivan65 Fri Aug 17, 2018 12:38 pm

    No problem,,,,,,,,these vans have been modified many times over the years so you dont know what you will find,,,,so dig in,,,,,,,see what you find,,,,,ask questions,,,,,,,we are here to save these vans lives,,,,,,
    Dan Scully
    Dan Scully


    Number of posts : 254
    Location : Apple Valley Ca
    Age : 67
    Registration date : 2016-07-30

    Replacing funky wiring Empty Wiring

    Post by Dan Scully Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:42 pm

    arracado wrote:One battery. I don't know man, this dude had things hooked up kinda funky, so it's possible the battery wasn't getting charged, but I haven't really been able to drive it much and it hasn't been driven much in general for a while. So not really sure. I think I'm just gonna start from scratch, put in a junction box and new regulator and get rid of this duplicate wiring. Plus it all looks like stereo amplifier cable and all of the cables are red! Grrrrrr!!


    Take a pic of the regulator plug on the alternator. As said in the other post it is probably a internal regulated one. All you will need to do is wire it correctly no need for a new regulator.
    donivan65
    donivan65
    Governor
    Governor


    Number of posts : 12218
    Location : San Diego, California
    Registration date : 2008-05-12

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    Post by donivan65 Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:00 pm

    Putting one of these REAL 1 wire alternators on ANY vehicle will solve the Worlds voltage regulator and wiring problems,,,,,


    Replacing funky wiring 1_wire10
    arracado
    arracado


    Number of posts : 47
    Location : Medford, OR
    Age : 49
    Registration date : 2018-08-14

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    Post by arracado Sat Aug 18, 2018 3:26 pm

    In a perfect world, the negative from the battery goes to the block, then the positive goes directly to the starter, from starter to junction box, then to alternator and fuse block, correct?
    arracado
    arracado


    Number of posts : 47
    Location : Medford, OR
    Age : 49
    Registration date : 2018-08-14

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    Post by arracado Sat Aug 18, 2018 3:28 pm

    That looks like a pretty affordable solution donivan. Probably a good time to do it along with the rest of the wiring.
    donivan65
    donivan65
    Governor
    Governor


    Number of posts : 12218
    Location : San Diego, California
    Registration date : 2008-05-12

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    Post by donivan65 Sat Aug 18, 2018 5:20 pm

    You might very well have that alternator on there,,,,,,but we need to know if yours is working 1st,,,,,a quick test is see what the battery voltage is,,,,if,,,,,the voltage goes up at least  1/2 volt when the engine starts,,,,that shows the alternator is charging,,,,you still still to find out how much,,,the negative cable bolts to the engine,,,you should have a smaller wire attached to the frame from the cable,,,,,the positive cable goes to the starter solenoid,,,,,then you need a 14 gauge fusible link on the feed wire to protect your wiring, WHEN,,,,not IF,,,,your wiring shorts out,,,,it just a piece of solder that melts before any wiring catches on fire,,,,then the feed wire goes to the Ammeter, and that is a problem,,,,then fusebox,,,,through a couple of connectors that always go bad,,,,,the alternator output just connects into that wire ,,,,,you want at least a 10 gauge wire to get the juice from the starter to the fusebox,,,,I kinda like these types of fuseboxes to hook my STUFF up to,,,,



    Replacing funky wiring New_bo10
    donivan65
    donivan65
    Governor
    Governor


    Number of posts : 12218
    Location : San Diego, California
    Registration date : 2008-05-12

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    Post by donivan65 Sat Aug 18, 2018 6:10 pm

    This surely is a Dodge disease,,,,,,the amps coming out of the alternator burn the bolts right off the ammeter,,,,,,Ammeters are bad,,,put a voltmeter in there,,,,,,the Dodge guys can give you more specific answers, I am just translating my chevy info into dodge talk,,,,

    Replacing funky wiring Dscn0519
    arracado
    arracado


    Number of posts : 47
    Location : Medford, OR
    Age : 49
    Registration date : 2018-08-14

    Replacing funky wiring Empty Re: Replacing funky wiring

    Post by arracado Mon Aug 20, 2018 6:32 pm

    OK so the previous owner confirmed that the Delco alternator that's in there is internally regulated. I guess that helps.
    arracado
    arracado


    Number of posts : 47
    Location : Medford, OR
    Age : 49
    Registration date : 2018-08-14

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    Post by arracado Tue Aug 28, 2018 4:22 pm

    OK was finally able to dive a little deeper into the wiring on this thing. Basically it breaks down as such:

    +/- cables going directly from battery to alternator


    A second + cable going from battery to this box near the starter:
    Replacing funky wiring Img_4810


    Second - cable going from battery to block


    From the mystery box, there are two cables running to the starter:

    Replacing funky wiring Img_4811

    The thick wire going to the nut on top comes from the large nut on the mystery box, the other wire on the starter nut goes up through the dog house to this box by the fan:

    Replacing funky wiring Img_4812

    The wire on the bottom of the starter goes to the center connector on the mystery box:


    Replacing funky wiring Img_4810


    I really just want to simplify what's going on here. All the wires are red. The ground going from the block to the frame is literally frayed, bare wire. Easy enough stuff to fix and rewire, I'm just not sure what all these components are and how to simplify everything.

    To summarize:
    1. What is the mystery box?
    2. What gauge wire should I use for the block to frame ground?
    3. How can I eliminate the extra set of cables going to the alternator (it's a Delco)? Is this possible?


    Any help is appreciated!
    arracado
    arracado


    Number of posts : 47
    Location : Medford, OR
    Age : 49
    Registration date : 2018-08-14

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    Post by arracado Tue Aug 28, 2018 4:48 pm

    One more thing, I identified the alternator. It's a Delco 7127SW3. This is a one-wire if I'm not mistaken, so not sure why there were two wires running to it from the battery.

    https://www.carid.com/quality-built/remanufactured-alternator-mpn-7127sw3.html

    EDIT: Tested it and it works.
    arracado
    arracado


    Number of posts : 47
    Location : Medford, OR
    Age : 49
    Registration date : 2018-08-14

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    Post by arracado Tue Aug 28, 2018 10:22 pm

    OK figured out a little more. The mystery box is the starter relay. So I believe this should work:

    1. Positive battery to relay (4 gauge)
    2. Negative battery to block (4 gauge)
    3. New relay-to-starter cable (4 gauge)
    4. Negative block to frame (6 gauge)
    5. Positive from relay to one-wire alternator (6 gauge)

    The alternator grounds to its mounting points, so no need to run a ground wire off it, but even if I did, it could go to the frame and doesn't need to go back to the battery as it was. Gonna hook it up tomorrow and hopefully take it for a spin!
    arracado
    arracado


    Number of posts : 47
    Location : Medford, OR
    Age : 49
    Registration date : 2018-08-14

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    Post by arracado Wed Aug 29, 2018 8:48 pm

    Success! Got it all wired and it fired right up tonight with no issues. Now on to the cooling!
    vanny
    vanny
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    Post by vanny Thu Aug 30, 2018 5:25 am

    Congrats! Way to stick with it! cheers


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