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Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

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Cuzz

Number of posts : 62
Location : Michigan
Age : 52
Registration date : 2015-07-17

Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by Cuzz on Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:27 am

Had allot of play in the wheel and tried to adjust the worm gear with no luck so I ordered a rebuilt box from "Red Head Steering Gears", had it installed and the play seems to be the same.. Below is a video showing how much I can move the wheel without any movement out of the other end of the steering box. I understand my larger diameter wheel will compound the play but it just seems pretty excessive to me.. There was a note that came with the steering box that says I cannot make any adjustment to the box or I void the warranty and they painted the worm gear locking nut, otherwise I would try to adjust the work gear.. It sucks because I didn't have time to installl it myself and paid a shop $220 to install it..

Video Link:

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jdlaugh

Number of posts : 224
Location : Tulsa, OK
Registration date : 2013-03-18

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by jdlaugh on Thu Jul 13, 2017 12:01 pm

Have you replaced everything else in the steering system, like the drag link and the tie rod ends? If not, crawl under the truck and have someone move the steering wheel. See if you can spot where there is unwanted movement.

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Cuzz

Number of posts : 62
Location : Michigan
Age : 52
Registration date : 2015-07-17

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by Cuzz on Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:34 pm

I was under it and while someone was turning it back and fourth, the spline on the other end wasn't moving unless we turned it beyond the play.. Once you turn it past the play, everything is tight with no slop or backlash. The drag link rod ends are both good too..

I talked with a technician from Red Head Steering Gears and they want me to shoot another video showing there is no movement on the other end while someone is rotating it back & fourth.. I told them I already verified it doesn't move on the box end so I don't know what a video will prove, especially when you cant see both ends at the same time to prove it anyways.
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donivan65
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Governor

Number of posts : 11450
Location : San Diego, California
Registration date : 2008-05-12

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by donivan65 on Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:55 pm

Is it possible the play is in the steering wheel adapter,,,,,,,,,,can you feel the play in the steering shaft with the steering wheel off?
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Cuzz

Number of posts : 62
Location : Michigan
Age : 52
Registration date : 2015-07-17

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by Cuzz on Thu Jul 13, 2017 2:09 pm

I will run through some more tests tomorrow when I'm back at the shop but I'm pretty sure its in the box, it doesn't feel like any play in the adapter at all. The entire steering shaft is turning when I was rotating it back and fourth but the spline coming out of the box wasnt..
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Cuzz

Number of posts : 62
Location : Michigan
Age : 52
Registration date : 2015-07-17

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by Cuzz on Fri Jul 14, 2017 6:22 pm

After showing more videos to the gearbox company, they are sending me another one.. My mechanic says he will reduce the cost to re-install another gearbox but the gearbox company said they may or may not help cover some of the costs.. Will post results, good or bad..
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Cuzz

Number of posts : 62
Location : Michigan
Age : 52
Registration date : 2015-07-17

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by Cuzz on Fri Jul 28, 2017 2:20 pm

Update: Just installed the 2nd remanufactured steering gear box and still have play (see below video).. The guy at Red Head Steering Gears said he hand checked this one so now I'm confused.. The steering wheel mounts directly onto the splined steering shaft which is a part of the steering box assembly and its a tight fight with no play so I know its not on the steering wheel end.. On the other end, the splined gear doesn't begin to move until you go past the play in the wheel so keep in mind that I still have to rotate the wheel past the play before I get any movement to the drag link.. I have a Pro Street 70 Camaro with the original 47 year old steering box that doesn't have this much play.. I now have over $800 wrapped up in this and its not much better.. Note how much I can rock it back and fourth with just one finger..

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jdlaugh

Number of posts : 224
Location : Tulsa, OK
Registration date : 2013-03-18

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by jdlaugh on Fri Jul 28, 2017 4:16 pm

That does seem like a lot. Here's a video of my steering wheel play. I can see the tire start to wiggle just a bit at the limits of the play you see here. I wish I had an answer for you. Crying or Very sad



On my list of things to do is take out the steering gear and clean off the 50 years of crud...

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Cuzz

Number of posts : 62
Location : Michigan
Age : 52
Registration date : 2015-07-17

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by Cuzz on Fri Jul 28, 2017 4:46 pm

Thank you for posting that video!!! Your play seems pretty normal and I would easily accept that much... The guy from Red Head Steering Gears just called and claims its not the gearbox and said he had instant response when he tested the 2nd one he sent me.. Meanwhile, I have a friend coming over this weekend and were going to put a dial indicator on the pitman arm and rotate just the play to see if we get any movement on the indicator and that should clearly verify it..

Now I'm waiting for my Disc Brake kit from D&D, which is a whole new story.. I called them on the 18th to verify they had all the parts ready to ship before I order and they said they would be able to ship on the 20th so I ordered the kit that day (the 18th).. Today is the 28th and we cant even get ahold of anyone there to find out where my kit is.. I have left at least 4 messages because they wont answer the phone and I'm about ready to just re-tract my Paypal payment..

I'm not having good luck lately, LOL
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vanny
Moderator

Number of posts : 8771
Location : Ashburnham, MA
Age : 58
Registration date : 2012-09-22

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by vanny on Fri Jul 28, 2017 5:21 pm

Good luck, I hope it works out for you. Disc brakes seem to be one of the best upgrades for these.


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jdlaugh

Number of posts : 224
Location : Tulsa, OK
Registration date : 2013-03-18

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by jdlaugh on Fri Jul 28, 2017 8:31 pm

I did the D&D tango. I ordered my brakes and never heard a peep out of them until about 3 weeks later after I filed a complaint with PayPal. Despite repeated emails and phone calls. It turned out to be an actual problem with UPS shipping -- made a lot worse by the fact they never sent shipping confirmation or even acknowledged the order. Bad, I mean really, seriously suck ass bad communication. Evil or Very Mad

Still, I've never heard of anyone that got burned. You'll eventually get your order.
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Cuzz

Number of posts : 62
Location : Michigan
Age : 52
Registration date : 2015-07-17

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by Cuzz on Sat Jul 29, 2017 7:40 am

jdlaugh wrote: Bad, I mean really, seriously suck ass bad communication. Evil or Very Mad

Still, I've never heard of anyone that got burned. You'll eventually get your order.

Your not kidding, if I did that to my customers i would be out of business.. I was hoping to have this installed before the Woodrward Dream Cruise.. My wife weighs all of 100 pounds and has to stand on the brakes to stop it, LOL..
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Cuzz

Number of posts : 62
Location : Michigan
Age : 52
Registration date : 2015-07-17

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by Cuzz on Sun Jul 30, 2017 5:55 pm

Ok, after some further examination, and using a dial indicator on the pitman arm, there is movement of the pitman arm where it feels like play in the steering wheel.. In other words, there doesnt appear to be play in the gear box (my apologies for blaming Red Head Steering Gear)..
What we did find (as circled in the picture below) is the "rear" of the draglink is pushing up/down a little on the connecting arm before it actually begins to move it in/out and that is causing the play.
Does anyone know if this would be due to having the springs re-arched and lifting the front end of the van and the draglink needs to be lengthened now or would this be due to a bad balljoint on the draglink?

This is not a picture of my linkage, mine is much cleaner, LOL
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Wolfster

Number of posts : 101
Location : Omaha, Ne
Registration date : 2016-08-27

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by Wolfster on Mon Jul 31, 2017 11:44 am

Cuzz wrote:
jdlaugh wrote: Bad, I mean really, seriously suck ass bad communication. Evil or Very Mad

Still, I've never heard of anyone that got burned. You'll eventually get your order.

Your not kidding, if I did that to my customers i would be out of business.. I was hoping to have this installed before the Woodrward Dream Cruise.. My wife weighs all of 100 pounds and has to stand on the brakes to stop it, LOL..

This kind of stuff doesn't instill a lot of confidence in me to place an order. Seems to be the norm with them though. Maybe it's a side business for them. Maybe he sources the parts once he receives an order due to cash flow problems.
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Cuzz

Number of posts : 62
Location : Michigan
Age : 52
Registration date : 2015-07-17

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by Cuzz on Wed Aug 02, 2017 7:52 am

After going round and round with Red Head Steering Gear, they said they tested this steering gear box before they shipped it to me and claimed it had instant movement from the steering shaft to the output gear on the other end and said the play had to be coming from somewhere else in the steering system... So after rocking the steering wheel back/fourth a kazillion times I thought it was in the arm that connects to the draglink (as i noted in my previous reply) but I found that movement was just a little flex in the arm itself and really didn't cause any play.. So I performed another test and I think this last test and video proves where the play is coming from.. Do I have a valid argument on where the play is now?

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jdlaugh

Number of posts : 224
Location : Tulsa, OK
Registration date : 2013-03-18

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by jdlaugh on Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:04 am

May be insulting to ask, but any chance the pitman arm is rocking back and forth on the steering box arm?
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Cuzz

Number of posts : 62
Location : Michigan
Age : 52
Registration date : 2015-07-17

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by Cuzz on Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:15 am

jdlaugh wrote:May be insulting to ask, but any chance the pitman arm is rocking back and forth on the steering box arm?

Its a valid question and I did check to make sure the splined gear on the gearbox was tight and rotating with the pitman arm.
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Cuzz

Number of posts : 62
Location : Michigan
Age : 52
Registration date : 2015-07-17

Re: Installed New Steering Box and Still Have Play

Post by Cuzz on Wed Aug 02, 2017 6:56 pm

After watching my video, Redhead Gear called and said there will be backlash if the gearbox isn't centered so they want me to do the same test with the gearbox centered this time.. They also said they just received my original gearbox (the core) and it wasnt in that bad of shape..

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