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Misfiring and idling

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ben429543

Number of posts : 25
Location : Glendale, CA
Age : 21
Registration date : 2016-03-23

Misfiring and idling

Post by ben429543 on Thu Dec 29, 2016 1:56 pm

Hi everyone, I had the wrong spark plugs in my engine (my lack of knowledge) and replaced them to the correct copper plugs. She was running fine with the other ones but shes misfiring now. I checked the firing order and it is set correctly. 1-5-3-6-2-4. Also my van won't idle in first gear. It will bog and shut off. This is a manual 3 on the tree 230
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Pats 69 G10

Number of posts : 48
Location : Huntsville, AL
Registration date : 2016-06-07

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by Pats 69 G10 on Thu Dec 29, 2016 3:46 pm

If it was running fine before I would try putting the old plugs back in and see if it runs right again. Then I would check all the plug wire ends and make sure none have come loose during the process of pulling wires off and on. Also plug gap. Just my 2 cents. You will get some other help I'm sure.
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donivan65
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Number of posts : 11421
Location : San Diego, California
Registration date : 2008-05-12

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by donivan65 on Thu Dec 29, 2016 7:00 pm

Do you have points in the distributor,,,,,,the Dwell reading should be 31-34 degrees on them,,,,,,get a can of spray carburetor cleaner,,,,,,with the air cleaner off,,,,,spray down the carb when it runs bad,,,,,,,see if it runs better or worst,,,,,did you mix up the wires,,,,,put the timing mark on 0,,,,,,,see if the rotor points to 1 or 6,,,,,,,and the firing order goes clockwise in the cap from there,,,,,,,,run some tests,,,,,get us some clues,,,,,,
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ben429543

Number of posts : 25
Location : Glendale, CA
Age : 21
Registration date : 2016-03-23

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by ben429543 on Thu Dec 29, 2016 8:21 pm

Yes it's a points, I'm actually looking to go hei. Ill try that but the carb is new, just had it rebuilt and I'm running it from a gas can because my tank was horrible. I don't think I mixed them up, I checked again today and they were what they were at originally before I messed with it. I have to check again for the timing mark because I couldn't find It earlier. Yes I ran it clockwise lol. I also checked to see if it was getting spark and it is. My second cylinder spark was off the first time and then I retired it and it corrected itself.
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ben429543

Number of posts : 25
Location : Glendale, CA
Age : 21
Registration date : 2016-03-23

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by ben429543 on Thu Dec 29, 2016 8:23 pm

I can't put the old ones in, they were warrantied at orilleys. I checked the plug ends and nothing was loose. Plug gap is at 30. Thank you doni and pat
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donivan65
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Number of posts : 11421
Location : San Diego, California
Registration date : 2008-05-12

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by donivan65 on Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:37 pm

Plugs need to be .035
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Dan Scully

Number of posts : 103
Location : Apple Valley Ca
Age : 60
Registration date : 2016-07-30

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by Dan Scully on Thu Dec 29, 2016 10:44 pm

ben429543 wrote:Hi everyone, I had the wrong spark plugs in my engine (my lack of knowledge) and replaced them to the correct copper plugs. She was running fine with the other ones but shes misfiring now. I checked the firing order and it is set correctly. 1-5-3-6-2-4. Also my van won't idle in first gear. It will bog and shut off. This is a manual 3 on the tree 230

Just a guess did you use a plug socket to change the plugs or just a regular 6 or 12 point socket? It is real easy to crack the porcelain insulator on plugs with a regular socket creating a miss fire. A plug socket has a rubber insulator in it to help cushion the plug insulator on installation.
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ben429543

Number of posts : 25
Location : Glendale, CA
Age : 21
Registration date : 2016-03-23

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by ben429543 on Fri Dec 30, 2016 9:55 am

Yes I used a plug socket, thank you
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ben429543

Number of posts : 25
Location : Glendale, CA
Age : 21
Registration date : 2016-03-23

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by ben429543 on Fri Dec 30, 2016 9:59 am

Ill regap the plugs also. Let y'all know when I can get back to my van. Also what oil do you use? I have 10-40 in it atm but I was told right now to use vr 20-50
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ben429543

Number of posts : 25
Location : Glendale, CA
Age : 21
Registration date : 2016-03-23

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by ben429543 on Sat Dec 31, 2016 1:52 pm

Ok I just did a compression test and checked my plugs and the wiring. This is my compression C1-143|C2-137|C3-140|C4-145|C5-146|C6-143 and I gapped all of them at 35. This is what they were before lol. C1-35|C2-31|C3-30|C4-30|C5-31|C6-31. She sounds a bit better but still misfiring:(
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donivan65
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Number of posts : 11421
Location : San Diego, California
Registration date : 2008-05-12

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by donivan65 on Sat Dec 31, 2016 2:54 pm

so,,,,,,,it was running fine until you decided to FIX it? Spray carb cleaner into the carb and on the intake manifold,,,,lets see if its a fuel problem,,,,,,pull each wire off the cap while its running,,,,,each cylinder adds 100 RPM,,,,,,see if when you pull a plugs wire out of the cap, the engine does not slow down,,,,,,,whats the Dwell??? Whats the vacuum reading?
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ben429543

Number of posts : 25
Location : Glendale, CA
Age : 21
Registration date : 2016-03-23

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by ben429543 on Sat Dec 31, 2016 3:43 pm

Vacuum is at 21 and I have never checked dwell. I am going to try to figure out how to check it. I pulled each plug while it was running and they all affected it slightly. I dont have a tach so I couldn't read it but I could hear and feel it drop a bit
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ben429543

Number of posts : 25
Location : Glendale, CA
Age : 21
Registration date : 2016-03-23

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by ben429543 on Sat Dec 31, 2016 4:22 pm

Lol I can't check any of this. I don't have a dwell meter and I dont have a timing light.
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ben429543

Number of posts : 25
Location : Glendale, CA
Age : 21
Registration date : 2016-03-23

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by ben429543 on Sat Dec 31, 2016 4:33 pm

Whats are dwell and point gap suppose to be? I cant find anything in this shit...
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jrinaman

Number of posts : 778
Location : zelienople,pa.
Age : 53
Registration date : 2011-03-10

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by jrinaman on Sat Dec 31, 2016 7:37 pm

http://www.tpocr.com/chevr1.html
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donivan65
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Governor

Number of posts : 11421
Location : San Diego, California
Registration date : 2008-05-12

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by donivan65 on Sat Dec 31, 2016 9:43 pm

21 inches is really high,,,, timing could be WAY advanced,,,,,,,these vans got lots of rules,,,,,stuff that happens to them after 50 years,,,,,like that timing mark is in rubber,,,,likes to slip and lie to you,,,,,what year is your van,,,what carb? we usually need dig deep for clues and answers,,,,,you need to be patient while we get to the bottom,,,,,,hang in there,,,,,and what do you mean ,,,wont idle in 1st gear,,,,,,when you step on the clutch, does that affect the RPM or its hard to take off or dies at stops,,,,,does anything change if you unplug the vacuum advance hose,,,,,,
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ben429543

Number of posts : 25
Location : Glendale, CA
Age : 21
Registration date : 2016-03-23

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by ben429543 on Sun Jan 01, 2017 8:59 am

Thank you jrinaman. My timing mark is metal. Ill take a pic. My van is a 64 but what I was told is its a 66 engine in it. It was kookiekrispies old van that got totalled and he used the internals on this van. I have a Rochester 1 barrel. It originally had a Carter YF but I took it to get rebuilt and the guy said it was trash so he rebuilt the Rochester he had. It was originally on 6 turns out for the mixture screw but I adjusted it to 3 turns.... When I start her she idles fine ither than she shakes a bit and misfires. When I put her in gear she runs but does not idle in a gear.. When I try to stop in gear she will shut off. When I step off the clutch, it affects the clutch sometimes. That's because my throttle doesn't sit all the way back down. I need to replace the springs. I have to give her alot of gas to get her to take off. The only hose I have for vacuum is from the pcv to the intake manifold. If I unplug that it wont start.
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ben429543

Number of posts : 25
Location : Glendale, CA
Age : 21
Registration date : 2016-03-23

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by ben429543 on Sun Jan 01, 2017 9:03 am

I also got her to idle lower yesterday. She doesn't seem to be misfiring while idling at a lower rpm. Here and there she will but very rarely. It only seemed to be when the rpms climbed that she would misfire.
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AzDon

Number of posts : 319
Location : Lake Havasu Az
Age : 61
Registration date : 2014-01-20

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by AzDon on Sun Jan 01, 2017 10:32 am

Okay........ It's a stick shift and it won't idle in gear? You mean with the clutch pushed in or chugging along with your foot off the gas? Also, the only vacuum hose is the PCV hose? Really? There is no vacuum advance diaphragm on the distributor with a small vacuum hose to it? If not there is probably an open vac port on the side of the carb.... Any unused carb ports MUST be plugged
My gut feeling is that your carburetor rebuilder sold you an incompatible pile of crap and that the base of the carb doesn't match the manifold and has a vacuum leak. Further, I'd be looking down the carb while pulling the throttle to see if the accelerator pump squirts because it sounds like there is a transitional stumble ......You also didn't mention how choke use affects any of this....
Really though, Starting from start, You should put the timing mark on TDC and satisfy yourself that the number one piston is actually at TDC....... From there, You should make sure that the dist rotor is pointing directly where the number one wire plugs into the cap. Then you should run a dwell meter to check the points. Replace the coil! (trust me on this, they are inexpensive, tough to diagnose, and mimic all kinds of other problems because they fail intermittently!) If you can get it to idle long enough you should set the initial timing with a timing light....
Once mechanical and electrical timing are deemed to be in order, Fuel delivery and vacuum management are the only potential issues left.
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ben429543

Number of posts : 25
Location : Glendale, CA
Age : 21
Registration date : 2016-03-23

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by ben429543 on Mon Jan 02, 2017 10:02 am

Chugging along with foot off the gas. It idles while moving but when it is not moving is will shut off when put into gear... And no vacuum on the distributor. Also all of the holes have plugs on the carb. The guy I went to is highly recommended I guess and he gave me a Rochester single barrel. I guess these were also used in our vans he said... The accelerator pump works. It squirts fuel. I checked the other day.... The choke is automatic on this carb. It is controlled by a heated coil on the manifold.... Ok I will try to do the timing. I just have to find a dwell meter and timing light. Ill keep yall updated. I've neverset timing before so this should be interesting:) Thanks a bunch everyone:)
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ben429543

Number of posts : 25
Location : Glendale, CA
Age : 21
Registration date : 2016-03-23

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by ben429543 on Mon Jan 02, 2017 1:19 pm

Um I took a closer look at the distributor and there is a connection to the vacuum advance... It wasnt hooked up. Should I plug it or run it somewhere? Also I have my #1 piston at TDC and the rotor is pointed towards the passenger headlight. Isnt it suppose to be pointed at the #1 plug? Also my point gap is at 13.
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jrinaman

Number of posts : 778
Location : zelienople,pa.
Age : 53
Registration date : 2011-03-10

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by jrinaman on Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:10 pm

rotor points to the number one plug wire post, not the plug itself or six if on exhaust stroke. I have never concerned myself with where the rotor pointed, as long as I connected the number one wire to that post. since it is running, DO NOT remove your wires or distributor, at least not at this point. still confused about idle in gear? it is a standard shift with clutch?
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donivan65
Governor
Governor

Number of posts : 11421
Location : San Diego, California
Registration date : 2008-05-12

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by donivan65 on Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:24 pm

,,,,you get 3 answers to where the rotor points,,,,,,,,when the notch is next to the 0,,,,,,that could mean the rotor points to #1 wire in the cap, or to #6,,,,,,,or,,,,,because the pulley is rubber mounted to the crankshaft and slipped,,,,it dont point to either of those plug wires in the cap,,,,,,points should be set at .019...... vacuum advance line needs to be connected between the distributor and carburetor,,,or the engine will be out of time and have a vacuum leak......









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ben429543

Number of posts : 25
Location : Glendale, CA
Age : 21
Registration date : 2016-03-23

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by ben429543 on Mon Jan 02, 2017 5:53 pm

Um it's a little late for that... I already took it out and tried to set it to the plug. I looked at this right before yall posted... Damn. Yes it is a standard 3 on the tree. So what I did. Was take the rotor out and set it to the number one plug but there is a flat end at the bottom of the distributor shaft so it wouldn't sit all the way down. So what I did was I turned the crank till it sit was able to sit in the notch. Now im back at TDC and the rotor is pointed at the seat... My pulley has not slipped. I pulled the plug and checked to see where the head is and its at the top with a coupple degrees of play. So set my dist to 19? I have it at 16 right now. I will see where to connect the vacuum line on my carb. I'm guessing it's the plug right next to the mixture screw?


Last edited by ben429543 on Mon Jan 02, 2017 6:19 pm; edited 1 time in total
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ben429543

Number of posts : 25
Location : Glendale, CA
Age : 21
Registration date : 2016-03-23

Re: Misfiring and idling

Post by ben429543 on Mon Jan 02, 2017 5:54 pm

How do you post pictures?

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Re: Misfiring and idling

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