BRINGING IT ALL TOGETHER.... A's, G's & E's


paint and body

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zinger68dodge

Number of posts : 34
Location : wausau WI
Registration date : 2015-07-13

paint and body

Post by zinger68dodge on Tue Dec 15, 2015 5:53 am

I live in the central Wisconsin area and I have taken extensive photos of my van to two well known and respected body shops to get some out look on what it would take to get a decent paint job done on my van.. and both where time and materials, witch is fine. But both said they couldn't do it for less than 17 thousand dollars. and that's if I brought them an complete shell. That's crazy.. the one shop said he charges 62 dollars and hour.. times a thousand hours is $6200. 1000 hours is 125 days at 8 hours a day. and it cant be done for that?? really. anybody know a reasonable respected shop in WI. Has the body shops gone mad?? just some frustrated thoughts.
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Twinpilot001

Number of posts : 6186
Location : spokane ,Wa.
Registration date : 2009-09-28

Re: paint and body

Post by Twinpilot001 on Tue Dec 15, 2015 7:43 am

Out west here =we call that price -Getting = "HOSED!!" affraid Redicilious for anyone/shop to give any price even close to that & not doing a custom show car!! here going rate for any decent body shop is around2000-3000.00 max materials & labor.Yet some paints (custom colors ) will add to that. I always look for a shop that doesnt have a lot of cars in the lot - waiting for work-ask around too - as many body guys can do work from home too & know where to go for paint booths to use also!! cheers
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zinger68dodge

Number of posts : 34
Location : wausau WI
Registration date : 2015-07-13

Re: paint and body

Post by zinger68dodge on Tue Dec 15, 2015 8:28 am

I was thinking of doing some research and buying my own paint from a supplier. Then give it to the shop for use. try to avoid any markup on the paint.? just brain storming. Thanks.
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Digz

Number of posts : 3732
Location : United States Six Lakes MI
Registration date : 2008-05-17

Re: paint and body

Post by Digz on Tue Dec 15, 2015 8:45 am

Got any pics you can post here? I'm a DIY'er like a lot of us, those kind of numbers amaze me. You have access to a garage? That kinda cash buys a lot of tools.

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Re: paint and body

Post by Guest on Tue Dec 15, 2015 9:01 am

zinger68dodge wrote:I was thinking of doing some research and buying my own paint from a supplier. Then give it to the shop for use. try to avoid any markup on the paint.? just brain storming. Thanks.

That just won't work, even if you go buy the same brand of paint the shop uses. They just won't use any paint the customer has bought, and even if they say they will, they'll still sock you with some other charge to make up for it.
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Seth G
Vintage-Vans Listings Manager
Vintage-Vans Listings Manager

Number of posts : 1744
Location : Anacortes, WA
Age : 44
Registration date : 2013-04-24

Re: paint and body

Post by Seth G on Tue Dec 15, 2015 9:03 am

Wow, that's completely insane. That's show car body/paint pricing by someone who's well known in the business. I'd ask around. A lot of shops are really only doing insurance work ftmp and won't want to do it. Depending on body condition, I'm sure you can get a really nice paint job for less than $5K, if the body is really good, less than 3 depending on the paint. Some paints will be thousands alone.
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zinger68dodge

Number of posts : 34
Location : wausau WI
Registration date : 2015-07-13

Re: paint and body

Post by zinger68dodge on Tue Dec 15, 2015 10:44 am

I just have the one posted on my avatar for now. Its a super solid body. very straight. It sat in a garage for some years. I'm trying to figure out the gallery stuff works...
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panelmanrd

Number of posts : 765
Location : kcmo
Age : 56
Registration date : 2009-10-04

Re: paint and body

Post by panelmanrd on Tue Dec 15, 2015 11:01 am

I have spent some time working in a body/auto repair shop,
about 15 years, their bread and butter is collision repair not custom or
ever overall paint jobs as they call them. the overalls take too much of their
time and the money they make is much less and they are afraid they will be
married to the paint job forever, so most places that quote you the very high
priced paint jobs are taking this into consideration, so if they do get the job it
will be worth it to them in the long run.
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samsvan

Number of posts : 411
Location : Sarasota, Fl.
Age : 54
Registration date : 2014-09-04

Re: paint and body

Post by samsvan on Tue Dec 15, 2015 11:26 am

"That's crazy.. the one shop said he charges 62 dollars and hour.. times a thousand hours is $6200."

Not trying to be a smart ass but 62 x 1000 = 62,000.
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zinger68dodge

Number of posts : 34
Location : wausau WI
Registration date : 2015-07-13

Re: paint and body

Post by zinger68dodge on Tue Dec 15, 2015 11:31 am

oops one extra zero.. 100 you got me.. lol alien alien
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zinger68dodge

Number of posts : 34
Location : wausau WI
Registration date : 2015-07-13

Re: paint and body

Post by zinger68dodge on Tue Dec 15, 2015 11:35 am

yes in all my excitement its 100 hours, 12 days. 8 hours a day. lol. I need a good laugh. I can do that at myself. Laughing
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samsvan

Number of posts : 411
Location : Sarasota, Fl.
Age : 54
Registration date : 2014-09-04

Re: paint and body

Post by samsvan on Tue Dec 15, 2015 1:01 pm

It would be nice to see pictures of what you're dealing with. If you aren't going to change the color, you won't have to paint the door jambs and if the roof is ok, not painting it would save you a ton. You can take all the trim off and the windows out yourself and reinstall it after paint to save some labor on their part too. From what I hear, Macco will do as good or as bad of a job as you pay them to do.
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jimthefred

Number of posts : 326
Location : Parksley VA
Registration date : 2012-01-15

Re: paint and body

Post by jimthefred on Tue Dec 15, 2015 4:33 pm

Well, being a pro paint and bodyman for 30 years I can tell you this. You wont get a great paint job for less than 5k (Think Red Lobster-Good but not great). Maaco can give you a a hack job for under 2k (production paint shop-think hamburgers like McDonald's). But the really good shops will only do it if it is a fresh canvas ( Great Steak Dinner!). This is where the money starts saying adios! they will take it from bare metal to guarantee no surprises down the road like rust or adhesion issues.There are always exceptions but this is the norm from what I see. As a side note,Most shops wont want to use your own paint as they cant warranty it. 16 k is show car territory and for a van may be a little steep but its in the ballpark. Its all in the prep and that's what costs.
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RodStRace

Number of posts : 3022
Location : Chino Valley
Registration date : 2010-01-21

Re: paint and body

Post by RodStRace on Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:36 pm

Remove all trim, lights and bumpers and set aside so they don't get lost or damaged - figure at least 3-5 hours, plus a bit of extra due to 40+ year old rusty bolts, clips and fasteners (this is CYA for a shop). Extra if the windshield is coming out. Much more if the door windows are coming out.
Install = 2-3 hours. Add if the glass was removed. Also add gaskets and whiskers.
Wash and wipe down the whole thing carefully before paint - 1 hour times 2 (primer and paint).
Take a DA sander and scuff all the surface area with at least 80 grit once, then again with 320 after primer - 2-3 hours times 2.
Hand sand the spots a DA would rip up or can't reach - another 2-3 hours (think drip rails, around lights, edges of bumper holes, lock and handles - 2-3 hours times 2.
Mask off the whole thing with quality tape and paper - 1-2 hours times 2.

This does NOT include the painter mixing, shooting, and cleanup time! Consider a low end at 2 hours times 2.
So, low end 21 hours, high end 30 hours.

At this point, you have not stripped and scuffed the jambs (x2), done a single bit of door fitting or ANY body work. Patch panels would be additional.

Sandpaper, they use the good stuff that works fast, since time is money. Figure at least 20 sheets of 80 and 20 of 320. I haven't bought it lately, but it's roughly a buck each. Call it $40.
Let's add 1 roll of 3/4" quality tape, a roll of 2" tape, and half roll of 24" paper. This is to mask the bottom edge, tires, and glass or openings. Figure $10-20.

A good painter relies on the booth, tools and materials (paint, reducer, hardener) to ensure his time makes him and the shop money. Comebacks and redos cost him money! They normally will not shoot customer supplied product because of this and if the shop buys it, they can sometimes get the paint supplier to cover reshoot material and labor. A customer that supplies the paint will not and will often complain about the extra time (they aren't paying for!) that it takes to redo.

So now go to your local PRO paint shop and price out a gallon of primer, a gallon of mixed (since you aren't doing the jambs) single stage paint and all the reducer and hardener needed. Figure at least $ 400-600, unless you get the cheap stuff. Don't forget that the shop needs thinner to clean the equipment, wax and grease remover to wipe down the van, a tack cloth and mixing cups/sticks.


So you have 20-30 hours, plus 500-700 in basic materials before ANY bodywork is done and the jambs touched. You CAN do it cheaper. I wrote a while back on my 108 that I did with the cheap stuff. But a shop isn't going to risk a poor rep, comebacks and a super-thin margin to save the customer a few bucks. You can also talk with the shop and see if you can remove the trim and scuff the van before delivering it. I would not suggest you do bodywork unless you have an agreement before-hand. DO NOT use primer in a can (non-catalyzed)!

Painting a Honda Civic takes a lot less time and materials than a Dodge 108 window van! All that extra space means more money! So don't go into a http://www.maaco.com/ and expect the posted special to apply to your van.

As for the local shops, only go with RECENT feedback and what is rolling out of the shop in the past few weeks! Most of these places don't retain employees for long periods, so what was a good shop a year ago may not be today.
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Lazarusvan

Number of posts : 1293
Location : Charleston, South Carolina
Age : 45
Registration date : 2011-02-22

Re: paint and body

Post by Lazarusvan on Tue Dec 15, 2015 8:35 pm

Since I am close to paint and have been thinking about it since January, I have asked a lot of questions about paint myself. My paint job is a great deal and I've seen other examples of work he has done. He is sticking with his quote, but he ran into a lot more headaches than expected. This single stage paint is a bitch to get off and he said 80 grit sandpaper would rip up in no time. Very hard to get clean edges, etc. He still couldn't get it off as much as desired, but at least we know it isn't coming off... Essentially, he under quoted it and had some rust repair to deal with as well.

Point being, there are unexpected items and time issues they can't control. His sanding work took several days longer than he expected. At $80/hr. that would have kicked my tail! He definitely used more primer and paper than he expected.

Find out what paint, how many coats, how many layers of clear, etc. Do you want it sanded/buffed out? Mine originally called for two and two plus how ever may primer coats, but he had to prime it a lot more than expected to properly block it.

In any regard, you can find someone that is competent that will do it for way less. Mine is costing $2,000 and it will look really nice. It is not in a sterile booth, so there will be a few dust particles, etc, but nothing I can't live with for the price.I would think he would have charged another $1,000 if he had known what he knows now. Find a motivated person willing to build their business and work on it in their spare time. It might take a bit longer but it will save you money.
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zinger68dodge

Number of posts : 34
Location : wausau WI
Registration date : 2015-07-13

Re: paint and body

Post by zinger68dodge on Wed Dec 16, 2015 5:29 am

wow super cool advice. thank you.. I have some time and will speak with some more shops and make the decision when the time is right. I will be trying to put a side a stash of cash, just for the job. I hope I can get it in paint before the beginning of the 2017 spring.

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