VintAGE-Vans

Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

BRINGING IT ALL TOGETHER.... A's, G's & E's


+3
Digz
Nightmoves
Joe Van
7 posters

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Joe Van
    Joe Van
    Moderator 1st Class
    Moderator 1st Class


    Number of posts : 4619
    Location : Ocala fl
    Registration date : 2012-10-11

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by Joe Van Mon Jan 19, 2015 3:11 am

    I Went to Lakeland FL this weekend to check out our future site for Vanorama this year it was a 200 mile round trip witch required me to get on highway I-4 and had to go in burst's of 80 mph + to keep up with traffic and from getting run over and after a couple of quick "Panic Stops" I need to change to disk brakes ASAP in the front before I jump back on the throughway again..Does anyone have a extra set of md1dadio's brackets that they did not use and are willing to part with them its the brackets that use the smaller GM 11 inch "One Peice" rotors..???.. I have 14 inch front wheels and don't want to buy 15 inch rims and tires again....Or any leads on something similar.!!!....He is currently out of them.....Thanks..Joe... Smile .


    _________________
    1966 GMC Handivan  "Panel"....1975 Chevy Van G10 "Panel"....1991 Chevy Van G20 "Conversion"
    Nightmoves
    Nightmoves


    Number of posts : 2214
    Location : Old Hickory Tenn.
    Age : 63
    Registration date : 2008-11-17

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by Nightmoves Mon Jan 19, 2015 9:12 am

    Are you speaking of the TA ,hat style rotor?
    Joe Van
    Joe Van
    Moderator 1st Class
    Moderator 1st Class


    Number of posts : 4619
    Location : Ocala fl
    Registration date : 2012-10-11

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by Joe Van Mon Jan 19, 2015 9:37 am

    Nightmoves wrote:Are you speaking of the TA ,hat style rotor?
    No from what I understand you have to have 15 inch rims on that style for the rims to clear the calipers.... Smile


    _________________
    1966 GMC Handivan  "Panel"....1975 Chevy Van G10 "Panel"....1991 Chevy Van G20 "Conversion"
    Nightmoves
    Nightmoves


    Number of posts : 2214
    Location : Old Hickory Tenn.
    Age : 63
    Registration date : 2008-11-17

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by Nightmoves Mon Jan 19, 2015 11:01 am

    Ok.Just checkin.Not the right ones for ya.Good luck.
    Joe Van
    Joe Van
    Moderator 1st Class
    Moderator 1st Class


    Number of posts : 4619
    Location : Ocala fl
    Registration date : 2012-10-11

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by Joe Van Mon Jan 19, 2015 11:51 am

    Nightmoves wrote:Ok.Just checkin.Not the right ones for ya.Good luck.
    I appericate it "Thanks" for looking.... Very Happy ..


    _________________
    1966 GMC Handivan  "Panel"....1975 Chevy Van G10 "Panel"....1991 Chevy Van G20 "Conversion"
    Digz
    Digz


    Number of posts : 3794
    Location : United States Six Lakes MI
    Registration date : 2008-05-17

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by Digz Mon Jan 19, 2015 3:27 pm

    I think what you are after are called BZ Brackets. They use the Nova style rotors that are integral to the hub? They are a flat bracket. Somewhere in here there are threads about them I think. Donivan uses them and Beaver Wally may still be to. Also Joe, it might depend on the rims you are using as to whether the M1's clear 14's or not.
    m1dadio
    m1dadio
    Chevy Guru


    Number of posts : 1778
    Location : north saanich
    Registration date : 2008-10-06

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by m1dadio Mon Jan 19, 2015 5:08 pm

    Couple comments:

    The mith that you have to have 15" rims for the M1d80ta brackets is just gosip that some vanners want to believe. There are about 37 million different 14" rims around, some fit the M1D80TA or the M1D10KN or the BZ brackets and some 14" rims don't fit any of those brackets at all and some fit one or two of those disc brake conversions.

    If you do a search for "wheel fit" and /or Disc brakes and this site and VCVC you will find many conversations about fitting 14" wheels on the M1D80TA disc set up. Some are right and others are straight up wrong. In fact I think Joyrde has 14" wheels that look just like yours in your avitar. By in large a greater part of the problem is many brake caliper castings are not all the same and some have copiuos amounts of useless casting you can grind off for a better fit. This is after all a "custom brake installation".

    see these links, first one Joyride talks about his install. I think he (Joyrde) also has his own web page where he shows many pictures of his install.

    The second link talks about 14" steely wheels that fit.

    http://www.vcvc.org/showthread.php/24203-Front-Disc-brakes-2014/page2?highlight=joyride

    http://www.vcvc.org/showthread.php/25386-Disc-brake-conversion-on-14-quot-rims/page2?highlight=disc+brake+wheel+fit

    http://www.vcvc.org/showthread.php/25039-M1D-Disc-brake-technical-update-July-2014-1-Pad-fit?highlight=disc+brake+wheel+fit

    there are alot more threads on disc brakes and wheel fit than just these three samples.


    JoeVan: The brackets you are thinking you have to have are the M1D10KN brackets, unlike the BZ brackets you won't have to move your shocks. Somebody may have a set to sell you, I am out of stock on those, try 108vanguy. If you want the BZ brackets you will have to move your shocks.

    Be informed; some 14" wheels will not fit any disc brake set up at all.


    M1D
    Joe Van
    Joe Van
    Moderator 1st Class
    Moderator 1st Class


    Number of posts : 4619
    Location : Ocala fl
    Registration date : 2012-10-11

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by Joe Van Tue Jan 20, 2015 2:17 am

    Thanks for the replies.!!!.. I did not realize there was so many different scenarios I have to think about this.. scratch ..It may be eayser to just sell my 14 inch rims and tires locally and go with some 15 inch ones.. I cant afford to take a chance to convert it over and they don't fit 14's..!!!..As most all of you know you have never seen me on VCVC there is a reason..!!!..Back in 2011-2012 I also was a lurker there and did I register in my legal name but when they made the site private I could no longer log on with my name.... I made several attempts to contact them with no response so I gave up thats when I joined VV and to this day I still can not get on that site or see any posts...!!!..I think for now my best bet is stay off the Highways and take the back roads....But I think in the end I will be selling my 14 inch tires and rims so when I do the conversion I know everything will fit... Grinding a little flash is not going to hurt me but I need a defent "YES" they will work before I tear it all apart.. I was going to replace the front springs at the same time and do it all at once but it all has to fall together....Let me think on this for a while..!!!...Thanks again for the Replies...Very Happy ..Joe Van...


    Last edited by Joe Van on Tue Jan 20, 2015 7:48 am; edited 2 times in total


    _________________
    1966 GMC Handivan  "Panel"....1975 Chevy Van G10 "Panel"....1991 Chevy Van G20 "Conversion"
    Joe Van
    Joe Van
    Moderator 1st Class
    Moderator 1st Class


    Number of posts : 4619
    Location : Ocala fl
    Registration date : 2012-10-11

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by Joe Van Tue Jan 20, 2015 3:04 am

    Digz wrote:I think what you are after are called BZ Brackets. They use the Nova style rotors that are integral to the hub? They are a flat bracket. Somewhere in here there are threads about them I think. Donivan uses them and Beaver Wally may still be to. Also Joe, it might depend on the rims you are using as to whether the M1's clear 14's or not.
    Thats the style I want flat bracket with one piece nova rotors but I really did not want to move the shocks..!!!..I need the (M1D10KN) brackets I can get all the other parts locally through our Shop..  rotors,,calipers,,hoses,,bearings,,seals,,... I am going to call Summit Racing where I bought the rims and give them the part number on my receipt and see if they will fit a mid 70's nova with disk brakes there is a lot of room on the inside of the rim diameter wise no step down flange behind the spokes where the caliper would be sitting......


    _________________
    1966 GMC Handivan  "Panel"....1975 Chevy Van G10 "Panel"....1991 Chevy Van G20 "Conversion"
    Joe Van
    Joe Van
    Moderator 1st Class
    Moderator 1st Class


    Number of posts : 4619
    Location : Ocala fl
    Registration date : 2012-10-11

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by Joe Van Tue Jan 20, 2015 2:32 pm

    I called American Racing and the Torq-Thrust "D" 14x6 with 3 3/4 back spacing will fit on a 70's Nova with disk brakes so I should be fine there but now I am assuming switching to front disk brakes I will have to change the master cylinder and add a per portion valve also so this is not going to happen over night..!!!..I will start gathering parts...Does anyone know which master cylinder I will need for the disk/drum combo that will fit on my van.???


    _________________
    1966 GMC Handivan  "Panel"....1975 Chevy Van G10 "Panel"....1991 Chevy Van G20 "Conversion"
    Twinpilot001
    Twinpilot001


    Number of posts : 6186
    Location : spokane ,Wa.
    Registration date : 2009-09-28

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by Twinpilot001 Tue Jan 20, 2015 2:43 pm

    look into any disc conversion for chev pu's--- 56 up - id bet a vetter master with 1 "bore!
    m1dadio
    m1dadio
    Chevy Guru


    Number of posts : 1778
    Location : north saanich
    Registration date : 2008-10-06

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by m1dadio Tue Jan 20, 2015 4:43 pm

    I like to use the Low profile master cylinder (like the ones you see on some corvetts)  the one with a 1" bore and the deep hole "if" you are going manual disc drum! There are many variables here! also a small vehicle disc/drum combonation vales and an adjustable proportioning vale and two residual check valves.
    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Dscn0511
    Some want to use a 2nd gen master for different reasons and that can de OK if you modify it properly.
    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Dscn0512
    That gives me the best Manual disc/drum system i have expirienced.

    YES there are alot of variables to be considered and even many more oppinions from people who have not ever done a disc brake conversion so you do need to ask the right people the right questions and do your home work so you will end up very happy with the final result.

    I wrote and pictured all of this in other posts, you can search for at will.

    M1D
    m1dadio
    m1dadio
    Chevy Guru


    Number of posts : 1778
    Location : north saanich
    Registration date : 2008-10-06

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by m1dadio Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:18 pm

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Dscn0513

    The combonation valve is the generic Disc/Drum valve used with an adjustable proportioning valve a little further down the rear brake line. You need a 10lb and a 2lb residual check valve and I switched the rear brake cylinders to the car ones that are a diffeent piston size. (don't quote me But I think they where smaller pistons used on Nova and camaro) I wrote about this with all the facts on anoher thread some place.

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Dscn0514

    same wheel cylinder but with smaller piston (and more abundant so easier to find)

    Assuming all four tites/wheels and air presure is the same, It is actually the wheel cylinder size to the caliper piston size that has most to do with "proportioning" . The added "adjustable valve" alows you to fine tune the proportioning and the porportioning part of the combonation valve provides for more refined and automatic but limited variable proportioning to some degree (variable when braking).

    I also added in a hydraulicly activated brake light switch because the factory switch is so unreliable.
    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Dscn0515

    notice it is pointed down so all the air will bleed out of the switch.

    m1D
    uncle ron
    uncle ron


    Number of posts : 91
    Location : orange,calif.
    Age : 76
    Registration date : 2012-05-31

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty disc brakes

    Post by uncle ron Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:25 pm

    https://i.servimg.com/u/f38/18/21/57/63/05612jpg" alt=""/>http://i38.serimg.com/u/f38/18/21/57/63/13812jpg" alt=""/>    pix 1  14 x 6  new torg thrust , #2  14 x 6 early Americans , #3 14 x 6 chrome  ,  smoothed up the castings a little bit .  M1D80TA     can't make the pictures work , I've used 3 different wheels w/this d brake kit .   https://i.servimg.com/u/f38/18/21/57/63/05616jpg


    Last edited by uncle ron on Tue Jan 20, 2015 11:29 pm; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : computer dummy)
    m1dadio
    m1dadio
    Chevy Guru


    Number of posts : 1778
    Location : north saanich
    Registration date : 2008-10-06

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by m1dadio Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:33 pm

    JoeVan here is the link with some usefull info towards the bottom.

    https://vintage-vans.forumotion.com/t42615-m1d-disc-brake-3-technical-updates-july-2014?highlight=disc+brakes+2014



    Nice looking van UncleRon!   Good post about your wheels , wish we could see the pictures.
    Thanks for that good information on 14" wheels.

    I know many people have used many different 14" wheels with the M1D80TA set up.

    Some vanners were disspointed to discover their older 14" wheels didn't fit when they did a disc conversion. Maybe thats where all the missinformation about wheel fit started.

    m1D
    Joe Van
    Joe Van
    Moderator 1st Class
    Moderator 1st Class


    Number of posts : 4619
    Location : Ocala fl
    Registration date : 2012-10-11

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by Joe Van Wed Jan 21, 2015 5:05 am

    Thanks everyone especially m1dadio for the photos and info..I used the residual valves before and the corvette master when I built my 41 Willys with a disk/disk combo...Last year I installed a 1969 2nd gen duel master and ran new lines but my parts supplyer said it is a drum /drum combo master so basicly I have to redo everything that I just did.... I am a little overwhelmed with it all right now but I know now what I need to do..!!!..Take a few steps back read some info and start collecting parts1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. 949478101st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Joe_4_10


    _________________
    1966 GMC Handivan  "Panel"....1975 Chevy Van G10 "Panel"....1991 Chevy Van G20 "Conversion"
    panelmanrd
    panelmanrd


    Number of posts : 801
    Location : kcmo
    Age : 62
    Registration date : 2009-10-04

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by panelmanrd Wed Jan 21, 2015 10:37 am

    hey Joe Van I sent you a pm hope this helps
    m1dadio
    m1dadio
    Chevy Guru


    Number of posts : 1778
    Location : north saanich
    Registration date : 2008-10-06

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by m1dadio Wed Jan 21, 2015 4:59 pm

    JoeVan;  That master is a 1' bore right! you can keep that master cylinder, that will be cheeper and easiest. All you need to do is remove the 10lb residual check valve that is built into its front brake port like I showed in the other post. Then you will need the combonation valve, one 2lb residual check valve for the front line and an adjustable proportioniong valve for the rear line. That will work out fine for you. I prefer the low profile master cylinder but you have to cut open the bracket wider to use it.

    m1d
    Joe Van
    Joe Van
    Moderator 1st Class
    Moderator 1st Class


    Number of posts : 4619
    Location : Ocala fl
    Registration date : 2012-10-11

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by Joe Van Wed Jan 21, 2015 6:20 pm

    Well that some "Great" news..!!!.. Yes it is a one inch bore..I would think you would leave the spring and the check valve out and put the faired piece back in so the line will seal right ..And the 2lb residual valve will replace the parts I took out.??..On my 41 Willys Coupe I had 4 wheel disk brakes with GM Truck calipers and a corvette master and only used 2-2lb residual valves but no proportioning valve and it stopped great do you think I could get away with out one or do you think I will I need one for a disk/drum set up?? ..American Racing said my 14 inch rims would work with disk brakes (Small Bolt Pattern) So why don't you put me on your list for the next batch of brackets (The ones you are out of stock on M1D10KN) and that will give me some time to save up for the rest of the parts..Just to be sure I will need to use the nova 1 piece rotors with those brackets right..?? Smile ..1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Dscn0510


    _________________
    1966 GMC Handivan  "Panel"....1975 Chevy Van G10 "Panel"....1991 Chevy Van G20 "Conversion"
    m1dadio
    m1dadio
    Chevy Guru


    Number of posts : 1778
    Location : north saanich
    Registration date : 2008-10-06

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by m1dadio Thu Jan 22, 2015 5:21 pm

    yes you put the brass taper seat back in and use one 2lb residual valve

    You should have proper proportioning valves for Disc/disc on your Willys and you will need proper proportioning for disc/drum on your van.

    The problem here is many vanners go from horibly bad brakes to some half assed conversion. Any half assed conversion is going to feel much better than the horifying brakes they had before so they think they now have best brakes as good as it gets, or thier wallet is telling them they diod a fantastic job and "on budjet" . (Thats not unreasonable thinking, its just absent of the whole truth) The whole truth is they will never know how much better the brakes could actually be if they had spent the money and did it up all the way right the first time. And now that thier brake job is complete they are not going to go back into it and make changes. (good enough) so to speak. I have gotten into some of these vans and drove them to find i am just jaw dropping speachless at how terible the brakes fel to me with the guy standing there saying "Good brakes AY!!" . I can't imagine just how terible the brakes must have been before they were converted and repaired.

    I can only tell you what works for me. ( i have tryed every master, valve and brake conbonation you could put on one of these vans) You are going to do what you decide to do, and ifyou are happy with the results, that will be a great achivement. because in the end you need to like what you have.

    I only have plans for the next batch of M1D80ta brackets and building a list for that. If you want the m1DK10N brackets i sujest you contact 108vanguy, he has a bunch of them.

    M1D
    Joe Van
    Joe Van
    Moderator 1st Class
    Moderator 1st Class


    Number of posts : 4619
    Location : Ocala fl
    Registration date : 2012-10-11

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by Joe Van Sat Jan 24, 2015 7:22 am

    Thanks for all the info m1dadio..!!!.. I really appreciate you taking the time to help me out..!!!..The reason I want the one piece rotor verse the hat rotor is when I put the aluminum rims on my van with a 1/2 inch thick mounting hubs the factory studs were way to short (about 3 threads sticking through the rim) so I already added the longer studs and now I have about 6-7 threads sticking out so add the thickness of a hat rotor and I am back to square one so unless the studs in your kit are a inch longer then the factory ones the hat style rotor wont work with my rims maby the steel rims but not my style..!!!..The problem is not a weak or soft pedal in fact after the duel reserve conversion it stops "Good" the pedal is right up top my concern is a quick panic stop or when I hit the brakes hard most of the time it goes straight but sometimes it darts to the right or the left so I am fighting to keep it straight in my lane and stop the van at the same time...I am a Auto Repair Shop owner EST 1987 and have been a mechanic for 33 years now so I have the ability and access to anything I need Lifts,,Taps,,Tools,,Welder,,except the brackets... I am willing to pay for a set "No Problem" but if I had the pattern I could "Easily" make a set myself..!!!..I just don't want to take the time if I can find a set already made.!!!.. I will be adding a proportion valve also along with a 2lb residual valve too up front and I have never cut corners when it comes to any brake parts we use all OEM replacement parts at our shop..... I have contacted 108vanguy on the (m1DK10N) brackets so I am waiting on a reply..!!!.. Smile ...Thanks Joe....1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. 105_0211


    _________________
    1966 GMC Handivan  "Panel"....1975 Chevy Van G10 "Panel"....1991 Chevy Van G20 "Conversion"
    m1dadio
    m1dadio
    Chevy Guru


    Number of posts : 1778
    Location : north saanich
    Registration date : 2008-10-06

    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by m1dadio Sat Jan 24, 2015 10:52 am

    With your expirience you allready know the many variables.
    My 68 is a 90" with the same size and inflated new tires all around.
    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Dscn0611
    I like the 15 X 7 wheels because my engineering knowledge tells me that is the right size of wheel and tire for this size/wieght of truck.
    You allready know its your tires that stop your van not your brakes.
    Your brakes just add resistance to the rotating  wheels. (hopefully, equally all around as required)
    I wrote into one of those other thread links how I tested this most recent conversion for all braking conditions from empty van to  400lbs of steel added behind the rear wheels. I am really gladI went through all that work because I was able to truely fine tune the brakes for proportining and adjustability.
    Now I can turn my adjustable proportioning valve to get unwanted rear lock up when empty to nolock up when empty  and then with 400lbs aft of the rear wheel wells I can ajdust for the rear lock up just barely before the front lock up on all out slam on the binders. Prety scary testing with 400lbs of scrap steel wanting to come at the back of my head.
    Anyways this brake system is now exactly in the adjustable fine tunning range of the adjustable valve that is should be and on this 90" that was achived by all the valving i included pluss the reduction of rear wheel cylinder bore size.
    In my oppinion this 68 van now brakes much better than my 65 with four wheel power disc brakes.
    Yes wheel stud lenght is very important, you need 9 threads of engagement to be safe and 90ft/lb torque on 7/16 X 20 studs.

    stock stud (OK for steel wheels)
    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Dscn0811

    The longer stud I recomend (seen on same steel wheel)
    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Dscn0812


    m1d

    Sponsored content


    1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???. Empty Re: 1st Gen Disk Brake Calipar Brackets.???.

    Post by Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Thu Mar 28, 2024 8:11 am